Elycee ~504 Hunter

[Stridur]

Hi Elycee and welcome to the forums,

1)List all the macros you use for dps and explain their use.

2)Find and link your best: Gara'jal, Elegon, Vizier, Ta'yak, logs.

3)What's your BM opener? Explain your priority for your opener.

4)How do you track your ICD's? Which ICD's should you be tracking?

5)What PC hardware do you currently use for 25 man raiding (CPU, GPU, RAM, etc.)?

[Ashin]

Ely,

It seems we missed eachother on Sunday. In addition to the previous questions are you able to talk in Mumble tonight (Monday)?

[Elycee]

@ Ashin. Yes, I'll be around pretty much all night after 8.

@ Stridur

1. Macros

Without actually typing them out:

-I use several stop casting macros for things like kill shot and silencing shot that are important to stop casting CoS for

-I use an RF/Stampede macro that is particularly useful in openers

-I use a BW/Rabid/KC macro

-Use the focus MD macro as well

That is pretty much the extent of it. Again I don't pvp and there really aren't any other macros people use I feel are beneficial to me

2. Logs

Vizier (Normal)

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-tbhwh1jdju3t5uoj/dashboard/?s=4129&e=4449

Blade Lord (Heroic)

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-tbhwh1jdju3t5uoj/dashboard/?s=10053&e=10511

Elegon (Heroic)

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-19gtbzdb9pkefa6i/dashboard/?s=6873&e=7329

Gara'jal (Heroic, but not a kill. For some reason we don't have any logs from this boss still active. As I didn't take the logs myself they aren't that complete anyways with the phasing and all but this one is about 5 mins)

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ctpefds7nlzn2ary/dashboard/?s=9492&e=9793

3. You mean the carpal tunnel opener?

My full BM opener on a standard fight (E.G. something where you don't alter the opener like Jin'Rokh where you should save for pools....though I go SV for that fight)

-Prepot with MD to tank

-RF + Stampede Macro (stampede pets do not gain bonus from BW)

-Dire Beast (doesn't benefit from effects of BW and it's focus free so it's not sufficient to cast during BW)

-BW + KC

-AMoC (the cost is reduced by half during BW and it's damage is increased by BW)

-Glaive Toss (higher damage output than AS so it's more important, not to mention the focus cost is a little lower and you can get cleave damage from it)

-After that it's pretty much spamming AS and KC prioritizing KC first of course, fitting in glaive toss over AS when it's up

-I'll refresh SrS with CoS instead of just casting a new SrS...under the affects of RF and often times lust the GCD will be the same so it's better to take the small amount of damage from CoS than none at all from re-casting SrS over the existing one

-When BW is up I'll use readyness

-Dire Beast

-Beastial Wrath+ KC

-AMoC depends on if the fight is single target or if there are benefits to cast it on another target depending on the fight. Obviously I won't recast it if the current one is still on going.

-After that it's pretty much the same thing as before KC > GT > AS

-The second RF CD is saved until lust is over. I'll generally try to use it with any procs if I can to make the most of it without delaying it too long

-Yes, there is another way to open that starts differently that requires being in camo next to the boss and opening with KC but IMO it's kind of risky and a lot of bosses don't really allow you to do that anyways. It's a damage boost but when you factor in everything from latency and people trying to pre-pot properly and stuff I don't feel it's worth it.

4. I've toyed around with a few addons but I've been using weakauras for this as I use the add-on for other things as well. I believe tellmewhen is a good addon for this also but haven't done much with it yet. Anyways, the purpose of this is to potentially delay a CD like BW for a trinket proc provided the trinket is fairly reliable to make the most out of both the trinket proc and say BW for example. Assuming you time things right to begin with, hence the importance of doign the opener properly, it should work out and it's worth delaying a second or two. Unfortunately I still possess the Relic which I used all last tier which is not very reliable as it only procs from crits instead of hits so...there really wan't much to track. There will be a lot more to play around with when I get my hands on some of the new trinkets that look fairly decent with recent changes to RPPM.

5. Just Updated just about everything but my GPU late last summer. I've been able to run LFR on max with this, as it's been a long time since I"ve done an actual 25 man:

CPU: i5-3570k

GPU: EvGA 465 1 GB

Ram :8 GB

125G SSD

OS: Win 7

[Ashin]

Elycee,

That sounds good. I will look for you around 9pm EST, but may be on before then.

Stridur,

Let us know if you are satisfied with his response, since I don't speak Hunter.

Thanks.

[Stridur]

3. You mean the carpal tunnel opener?

My full BM opener on a standard fight (E.G. something where you don't alter the opener like Jin'Rokh where you should save for pools....though I go SV for that fight)

-Prepot with MD to tank

-RF + Stampede Macro (stampede pets do not gain bonus from BW)

-Dire Beast (doesn't benefit from effects of BW and it's focus free so it's not sufficient to cast during BW)

-BW + KC

-AMoC (the cost is reduced by half during BW and it's damage is increased by BW)

-Glaive Toss (higher damage output than AS so it's more important, not to mention the focus cost is a little lower and you can get cleave damage from it)

-After that it's pretty much spamming AS and KC prioritizing KC first of course, fitting in glaive toss over AS when it's up

-I'll refresh SrS with CoS instead of just casting a new SrS...under the affects of RF and often times lust the GCD will be the same so it's better to take the small amount of damage from CoS than none at all from re-casting SrS over the existing one

-When BW is up I'll use readyness

-Dire Beast

-Beastial Wrath+ KC

-AMoC depends on if the fight is single target or if there are benefits to cast it on another target depending on the fight. Obviously I won't recast it if the current one is still on going.

-After that it's pretty much the same thing as before KC > GT > AS

-The second RF CD is saved until lust is over. I'll generally try to use it with any procs if I can to make the most of it without delaying it too long

-Yes, there is another way to open that starts differently that requires being in camo next to the boss and opening with KC but IMO it's kind of risky and a lot of bosses don't really allow you to do that anyways. It's a damage boost but when you factor in everything from latency and people trying to pre-pot properly and stuff I don't feel it's worth it.

Your opener and priorities are little off, I understand that BW doesn't affect DB but it shouldn't be prioritize over KC and AMOC. As you want get off as much KC in one fight as possible. You didnt list Hunter's mark or serpent sting in your opener . Also you use your 2nd AMoC during the second Bestial Wrath, even if your first is not over yet, since it is on a 2 minute cooldown and your BW is 1 minute cooldown, and you want that to be synced up. Why would you wait for BW to be up to use Readiness when you cast two KC back to back when the first KC is coming off cd?

In the opener with in terms of refreshing SrS, Ultimately (with RF/Lust) if you have a CoS cast time of about 1.3secs it becomes about equal to manually refreshing Srs and then using an arcane shot(as far as refreshing Srs goes) CoS does 20k(non crit) and refreshes SrS in 1.3 sec manually cast,

Srs and Arcane doing 32k(non crit) in 2 secs

As you can see CoS does about 2/3 the dmg of arcane in about 2/3 the time.

Ultimately, If your CoS cast time is lower then 1.3sec then use it to refresh SrS(remember to use it wisely in a way that you will cobra again to refresh before it falls off) If you need focus, then it should be wiser to use CoS to refresh also. Otherwise manually refreshing should be the winner.

Personally what I do is,

Use cobra to refresh if cast time is at or lower then about 1.3sec or I need focus. Otherwise manually refresh if you have very high focus during BW so you don't focus cap...(witch I do in my opener. I ignore the hasted rule because I feel it's better to get the 15 secs off one global then having to cast CoS every 6 secs, but this only is a problem in the very long BW'd opener)

Overall, looking at your priorties in shots is maybe why the deeps on your logs are not as high as they should be with your current gear but thank you for getting back to us with feedback and good luck on your app.

Edited March 18, 2013 by Stridur

[Elycee]

Yeah. I totally forgot to mention the initial SrS and casting hunter's mark pretty much as soon as I see the boss in my los. I always cast SrS before RF/stampede.

As for dire beast, you're probably right. In fact that is exactly how I did it for most of the expansion until recently because it made more sense than what I've been doing lately. As for AMoC, I'm really not sure I understand what you're saying, and if I do I don't think I agree. I've never heard that you should re-cast it when the initial one still has 20 seconds left (or ~15 if using 4 t14 piece as I am) as that is a pretty sizeable loss of damage. As far as I know you would end up with more dps using Lnyx Rush than wasting that much of an AMoC CD. I know people do exactly what you are saying with Lynx as it's a shorter CD but I've never seen AMoC casted like that unless it's scumbag dps or as I said above a mutlitarget fight like Council. However, there are so many different methods for opening, for example on this thread there are some people that are saying different things...this was before 5.2 but with virtually no BM changes I think it's still relevant.

http://us.battle.net...opic/7709122114

As for damage output, I agree it could be higher on some fights. That being said, we don't always have all the buffs in 10 man that a 25 man raid has (for example the 4% physical damage debuff) but it always depends on the raid comp. And not to use it an excuse but in general someone from a 10 carries more responsibility outside of delivering dps towards their raid than someone from a 25. Dispelling, interurrupting, having fewer people that can soak sparks, cc, etc. It adds up. Also keep in mind my ilvl was about 10 levels lower than it is now then when those logs were recorded.

Anyways, I'll be keeping an eye on this forum and regardless of your decision, I thank you all for your time and effort. I'm not going to ask you to recruit me, I'll ask you to recruit whoever you feel is better for your team. Good luck with progress this week and if I'm not there with you next week, I still wish you the best of luck.

[Stridur]

BW Last 16 secs with 4pc, you just want make sure before your 2nd BW runs off cd that you pop the 2nd Amoc, which you might have 2-3 seconds still left from first Amoc debuff, which isnt as much as dps loss, than losing 60 focus. Honestly I would not use the wow site pages unless it was sticky post for stuff on your class. I understand that 10man is lacking buffs and you might have more duties to do, that's why the logs I ask for didnt require soaking sparks, or dispelling. Dispelling and interrupting shouldn't make you dps less by much at all its only one gcd your using more.

[Namour]

Sorry for jumping in here if this is out of place, but it is an interesting hunter discussion and I thought this might be helpful...

For 2nd Amoc with T14 4 piece I have found what works well to avoid clipping and still get benefit of cheap focus is the following opening

(hunters mark/md/pre-pot)

SS, BW/KC (macroed), AMOC, GT, DB, Stampede/RF (macroed), AS, KC, readiness, KC, GT, DB, AS, AS, KC, SS, AS, AS (BW done but still plenty of focus), AS, AS, BW/KC, AS, AS, AS, AS, GT, KC, Amoc (which dropped off about 2 sec ago), CS, etc...

By delaying that 2nd BW a few seconds after the first drops off you reduce how tight the collision is btw end of 2nd BW and 1st AMOC ending; you are still flooded in focus and so can cast a few AS's without needing to cast CS and the delay in the BW won't shift total number you get except in a few unlucky situations and even then would only cost you a few sec of uptime.

I think there are probably a number of slight variations on this that work equally well, but this is what I have been able to do with some consistency. Am chagrined I will have to give up the 16 sec BW once I replace T14...really like what it does for opening sequence.

[Elycee]

BW Last 16 secs with 4pc, you just want make sure before your 2nd BW runs off cd that you pop the 2nd Amoc, which you might have 2-3 seconds still left from first Amoc debuff, which isnt as much as dps loss, than losing 60 focus. Honestly I would not use the wow site pages unless it was sticky post for stuff on your class. I understand that 10man is lacking buffs and you might have more duties to do, that's why the logs I ask for didnt require soaking sparks, or dispelling. Dispelling and interrupting shouldn't make you dps less by much at all its only one gcd your using more.

Right. I've been casting AMoC in the last few seconds of my second BW for half focus, but I try not to clip it more than a second or two, if that is what you're saying before than I agree and it is when I've been doing. On the contrary I think I would just cast it after BW if I didn't have the 4 piece, I feel losing 10 or more seconds on the initial AMoC really won't equal more dps unless the fight is really lengthy...for example if I can only get off two more AMoCs until the fight is over. I know a lot more people are using Lynx Rush now than they were before so maybe I'll drop AMoC for that when I drop 4 piece instead. I'll have to run some sims.

As for my info I get it from all over the place, I try to be careful and make sure the person is actually credible. I just happened to find an example of what I meant of people in top guilds using all different openers, I mean I've seen hunters in different top 100 guilds have differing strategies, sims aren't 100%, so it's more or less just organizing priorities and applying trial and error, I guess.

[Evgeny]

BW/KC (macroed)

I would never claim to be an expert on Hunters (wouldn't even say I'm proficient). But I do remember a discussion with a Hunter friend of mine recently about not putting KC in a macro with BW, as server-side lag and spell queue can cause the KC to go off before you pet is buffed by BW. May e check your logs and find out if that's the case here?